Ahead of Tribeca, Indigenous Editor Leo Koziol catches up with Smoke Signals actor Cody Lightning to find out about life as a meme, the struggle to keep his pants on and the Rez humor in his hilarious new docu-parody, Hey Viktor!
Cody Lightning (Plains Cree) is famed for playing Young Victor in the 1990s cult hit Smoke Signals, a character who must put up with his family friend Thomas saying “Hey Victor!,” before every question, from “what do you know about fire?” to “why’d your dad leave, does he hate you?”
In spite of recognition for his work since, it’s fair to say Lightning’s filmography is not as extensive as many of his Smoke Signals co-stars. That’s the conceit behind Hey Viktor!, a raunchy, no-holds-barred, self-referential docu-parody that plays on Lightning’s lack of fame as he attempts to mount a sequel to the film that made him a meme, a quarter of a century later.
In this exclusive clip from Hey Viktor!, Lightning is an acting coach, guiding several young actors through a Smoke Signals scene in which his father Arnold leaves the family—only problem is, none of the kids has the personal experience he does:
While it’s not compulsory to see the earlier movie ahead of the world premiere of Hey Viktor! at Tribeca this week, it wouldn’t hurt. The cultural significance of Smoke Signals amongst Native North American communities cannot be overstated. The “Native American mumblecore” hit arrived in 1998, after a century of cowboys-and-Indians movies where the Indians all died and the white guy got the girl.
In Smoke Signals, Native communities at last saw their contemporary selves on screen, in a film made by Native Americans—director, writer, producers, crew and leading roles. The film made a star out of Adam Beach as stern, grown-up Victor and a cult character of Evan Adams as eccentric, chatty Thomas Builds-the-Fire (and Simon Baker as younger Thomas).
But for Lightning, it’s been “Hey Victor” since the late nineties; a Youtube mashup has half a million hits, there’s a dance remix and lately, some pretty awesome TikToks. As Cody tells me, sometimes the only way out of a meme is straight through.
What was it like being a kid and being a meme?
Cody Lightning: There are hundreds, if not thousands, of Smoke Signals memes, and they’re constantly making new ones. Sometimes people would say, “Don’t you get annoyed by them?” I’m like, “Hell no. I love those.” I love the memes. They’re hilarious. I’m really big on humor and making jokes about myself, making fun of myself. Me and my friends, we’re all very big on making fun of ourselves. So anytime memes are made, I think it’s hilarious. I love it.
Would you call your film as made by Rez for Rez [by Native, for Native]?
Very much, by us for us. There’s a lot of inside jokes. There are some people that haven’t seen Smoke Signals, so some of the jokes may not land for them. But a lot of people have seen it, especially in Indigenous communities, so a lot of those jokes are going to land when we start showing it to broader audiences.
How long has this film been in gestation?
Like most projects, it was all just a joke amongst me and the buddies having beers and joking around. We’d be sitting around, me and the guys, in a restaurant and there’s like a 30-minute wait. “Well, just go tell them you’re little Victor. Just go tell them you’re little Victor as a joke. ‘Don’t you know who I am?’”
We really hit the ground running with it five years ago, we went to a festival and pitched it for a grant. Out of 50 filmmakers we were in the top ten selected and then we were in the top three. Unfortunately, we didn’t get that grant to make it, but a lot of producers and people that were there said, “Even though you didn’t win, you guys need to make this. It’s hilarious.” It was a crowd favorite amongst all of the pitches.
So we [Lightning and co-writer Simon Miller] went up into the mountains of Banff and we stayed up there for a few weeks and pumped out the script. From there, we got some guidance from other filmmakers and writers to fine-tune everything. We were able to get that done and we pitched it around and we had a lot of doors close on us, which I’m used to as an actor. You audition, you don’t get a call back. You audition, you’re so close and then you don’t get it.
That rejection part happened quite a bit until finally Téléfilm said, “You know what? We love this. We’ll take a shot.” Once Téléfilm was involved, other companies were like, “Oh wow, so this is serious.” Téléfilm is very legit and they fund a lot of projects up here in Canada. So once we got that under our belt, we had a few other people say, “Yeah, we’ll go with you guys. We think that there’s potential there.”
It’s got low-budget, indie film vibes, but then you’ve got Colin Mochrie and Hannah Cheeseman in there, actors you probably need a pretty good budget to get. You can call on favors to the Natives from Smoke Signals, but what about the non-Natives?
Colin Mochrie was actually very easy to get. We literally were like, “Let’s reach out to him,” and shot him an email. And within that day, he got back to us and said, “Yeah, send me the script.” And then a day or two later, he is like, “This is hilarious. Yeah, I’m on board.” And we’re like, “Wow!”
He is kind of playing a parody of himself as well. I guess he loved that!
There were a few people that I had in mind for the character of Kate while writing, and then it just didn’t work out. So we opened up the gates for auditions and there were so many good contenders for that role. It was really hard down the line and I said, “You know what? I like Hannah, I like my chemistry with her.” As soon as we met in person, it was like we’d been best friends for years, like the characters portrayed in the film.
Hey Viktor! is quite raunchy—you’ve got a Forgetting Sarah Marshall moment or five.
Yeah, full frontal. Anyone that knows me knows that I’m not afraid to get naked on camera. There’s another film that I had acted in called Mohawk Midnight Runners. It’s a short film by my friend Zoe Hopkins. She cast me in that. Zoe asked a few filmmakers and friends, “What Indigenous actors do you think wouldn’t be afraid to get naked on camera?” And she said, ten out of ten were like, “Try Cody Lightning. Cody will probably do it.”
She got in touch with me and said, “Hey, Codes, I have a script and I would love for you to read it.” And I was like, “Sweet.” She goes, “Are you comfortable getting naked?” I was like, “Yeah.” While I was talking with Zoe on Skype, like I’m talking to you now, I was slowly taking my pants off like this from the waist down and I said, “Oh, I think someone’s at my door.” I got up and I walked away, so you can see my butt. She was like, “Oh my gosh.” I was like, “I’ll do it.” And she’s like, “Okay.”
Was your film scripted from the beginning, or did you improv?
Oh, there was a lot of improv. The way we wrote it—and I told the actors this as well—is that our script is more of an outline and a guideline of how we want the direction of the scenes to go. But let’s play with this. If we have anything that just comes off the top, let’s just go with it. If it works, it works. If it doesn’t, it doesn’t.
Letterboxd is all about the movies. What is your favorite Native film of all time?
I really like Indian Horse and the actor in it is young Sladen Peltier. I love that kid. He’s awesome. I’ve gotten to work with him. I love that story.
My mom, Georgina Lightning, has a film called Older Than America, and I’m not just saying this because she’s my mom. She loved that film, it’s really powerful. To separate her as my mom, when I watch that film, I always get really emotional during certain scenes.
I do love all of Taika’s stuff. Also Powwow Highway because I was young when it came out and Gary played my dad in Smoke Signals and he’s in my film.
What’s your favorite Adam Beach film?
Suicide Squad. I’m just kidding. What’s the war movie he did? Windtalkers. He looked pretty sexy there.
What’s your favorite Cody Lightning film of all time?
I will have to say a film that was never released. It’s called The Brave. It was with Johnny Depp. He wrote and directed it. Marlon Brando was there, there were a lot of great actors there. I was a little boy when I worked on that. I played Johnny Depp’s son. I was nine years old when we filmed that. Just to be on the set was amazing. It was such a cool set. We lived next to a big fake landfill. It was a lot of fun to work on that as a kid.
I’m a big fan of your role in Sterlin Harjo’s film as well.
Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yeah, Four Sheets to the Wind. That was a great one to work on.
I hear something else is coming up with you, with Marvel?
Yes, actually. I am an actor in the show called Echo, and that’s coming out November 29th on Disney+ is what I’ve been told. I’m not giving anything away because I have to be careful with what I share about that project. I have a really awesome fun part in it. That was an awesome time down in Georgia, we filmed that, and I was down there for six months. That Georgia heat with the humidity, whew, it was tough, but we got it done and I had a blast filming.
Oh, well, hey, thank you so much for your time, Cody. I’m here in Aotearoa, New Zealand on tribal lands. All the best to you for your adventures with your film. I don’t think the world knows exactly what they’re in for.
Yeah, I know, and that’s great. I’m looking forward to it. Thanks a lot, Leo. It was such a pleasure meeting you.
Oh, pleasure meeting you too, Cody. Kia ora!
‘Hey Viktor!’ premieres at the 2023 Tribeca Festival in New York City, screening on June 8, 9 and 17 and streaming in the Tribeca At Home programme June 19 — July 2. Tickets here.
